change default template engine

[defunctzombie]

Should we change the default to something other than jade? Something like hbs will let users use html out of the box versus learning a new language.

Just an observation from some feedback on getting a new user going with express.

[dougwilson]

I am 👍 on using something more HTML-like out of the box. ejs may be a better candidate, though.

[defunctzombie]

Cool. I am a not a fan of ejs (think it is a bit strange and too open ended when it comes to allowing code in template) but can be convinced otherwise.

[Fishrock123]

I prefer jade. With the entire "mean stack" thing, I'd say it is popular enough.

If nothing else, I guess one of those? There's also http://mozilla.github.io/nunjucks/, which may be popular enough to consider supporting in the future.

FWIW I'd say hbs sounds the most popular? idk.

[jonathanong]

i would just say use the most popular. i think handlebars is the most popular.

[dougwilson]

The main reason I suggested ejs is because compared to jade, hbs has like no logic abilities. In Perl, the frameworks like Mojolicious use a similar templating language called epl by default, which is exactly like ejs, but of course Perl code instead of Javascript.

Yes, ejs and the like do not provide the best separation of concerns, but it's one of the reasons people reach for jade over hbs anyway. To me, ejs is like jade, but lets you use actual HTML.

[dougwilson]

If I were to choose between jade and hbs, though, I would say hbs (in fact, it is the only templating I use with express anyway).

[rlidwka]

I prefer jade. With the entire "mean stack" thing, I'd say it is popular enough.

+1

We are supposed to teach people good things, right? If they don't like to learn new language, they can always change it in command-line.

But by default it should output the best code node.js community came up with, and right now that's jade imho.

[Fishrock123]

What alex said.

(Also, github needs to make their close button not look like a cancel button..)

[alanjames1987]

I think ejs or hbs are the most standard looking for someone coming from other languages and most standard to use in front end JavaScript. Ruby has erb, Perl has epl, and PHP's termplating syntax is very similar to ejs.

I would vote for ejs just because it's concepts and syntax are the most cross language compatible, a plus for anyone wanting to convert project's over to Node.

But, ejs and hbs are more compatible with regular HTML than Jade, so either is a great choice.

[danielrohers]

I prefer hbs. Really, it's just what I use with express.

[dougwilson]

Just so everyone knows: this is not about what templating engine you prefer, but what templating engine a brand new person to express should start out with.

[danielrohers]

Yep, my opinion is that it uses hbs. Believed it to be easily understood by analyzing the context of the discussion.